Many of our Ankh-Theb pitches have had some version of a Mummify mechanic, but I don't think any of them is a slam dunk. "Vanillification" isn't likely to be a crowd-pleaser, and reincarnating DFCs feel more Indian that Egyptian. It's also possible, as Wobbles suggested, that mummies simply aren't scary unless you take them out of ancient Egypt. Readers, can you build a better mummy?
Interesting question. Thinking about what wobbles said, perhaps part of the problem is that, IN an egyptian setting, mummification is the normal death rite, so "produce generic 2/2s" is quite appropriate.
ReplyDeleteBut in a modern setting, you only see mummification when someone stumbles onto the mummy of someone really important and it turns out to have a horrible curse. A la Vengeful Pharaoh (which I think is a good design).
So we need to resolve those two different views, or pick one or the other. The second trope of a mummy as a monster is more appropriate to magic, but the first of a mummy as a normal part of death is more appropriate to the setting.
Brainstorming at random, maybe steal some ideas from Vengeful Pharoh, something like
"Mummify {2} (When this dies, exile it unless you pay {2}. When [something] happens, you may return it from the graveyard to the battlefield.)"
An interesting idea, but I think the effect needs to locked down (which could be what you intended) so there aren't lots of triggers to keep on top of.
DeleteMummies tend to wish to lay undisturbed in crypts so I always read VP flavour as let me rest in peace or I will awaken and kill you, which is what I think we should try and capture. Dealing damage first though isn't popular and feels very white as an ability. Let's throw a few ideas down:
Mummify {3} (When this dies, exile it unless you pay {2}. When another card enters your graveyard happens, you may return it from the graveyard to battlefield.)"
The flavor is less clear here, why should dying trigger mummify effects, or worse discard or mill effects. Possibly dying is just easier.
Mummify {3} (When this dies, exile it unless you pay {2}. When a creature dies, you may return it from the graveyard to battlefield.)"
If undying magic managed to fit 4/5th the color wheel and morbid and unearth 3/5th, then we quickly only have ask ourselves whether white could have mummies.
Returning the dead to life is in their arsenal, even if it is not a particular common ability. Distancing the keyword from mummies might help.
Resurrection (When this dies, exile it unless you exile another creature card from your graveyard. When a creature you control dies, return ~ from the graveyard to battlefield.)
Not sure how this version plays but it feels susceptible to broken combos. We will still have some problems at common but we can at least throw down a few thought.
Burning Oil
Creature - Elemental
Haste, Trample
During your end step sacrifice ~.
Resurrection (When this dies, exile it unless you exile another creature card from your graveyard. When a creature you control dies, return ~ from the graveyard to battlefield.)
6/1
"It would be a mistake to think it truly out."
Guards of Pharoah 2WW
Vigilance
Resurrection (When this dies, exile it unless you exile another creature card from your graveyard. When a creature you control dies, return ~ from the graveyard to battlefield.)
2/3
"Our duty to pharoah will outlive our mortal forms"
Niledweller 2GG
Creature - Crocodile
When you control no other creatures, sacrifice ~.
Resurrection.
5/5
Seer of the Sands 2UU
Creature - Snake Cleric
When ~ enters the battlefield, Scry 2.
Resurrection.
2/2
"I survived without food in desert for years, what made you think your puny spear would work." - Sssshizzinik, Seer of Shenai.
If you look at other games that have mummy armies, there are really two distinct types: the lowborn dregs, who are basic skeletons/zombies, who died and have come back weaker; and the highborn nobles, who have come back as more powerful beings.
DeleteIf not for the "don't mix +1/+1 counters and -1/-1 counters in the same set" rule, the first is persist, the second is undying.
The classic mummy trope is most certainly the noble, with the mummy's curse and all. The word Curse of course makes me think of Wither, which is a great way to show the mummy making its enemies weaker when they do battle.
In terms of DFCs, using Loyal Cathar as a model could certainly work. Some come back smaller and weaker, others come back more powerful.
None of this is an original implimentation, just examining previous ideas for inspiration. I'll think more on this today.
Ha. I totally search Gatherer a couple times before I remembered that the card I wanted to reference was from our M13: Cursed Tomb
ReplyDeletePerhaps:
Entomb (When ~ dies, you may exile it under a non-creature permanent you control. When that permanent goes to the graveyard, return ~ to the battlefield.)
It could alternately return the card to your hand, or to the top of your library.
Or we could just make a card or so like this:
Pyramid 3
Artifact
Whenever a creature you control dies, if there are no cards exiled under ~, you may exile it under ~.
X: If X is greater than the number of stone counters on ~, put a stone counter on it. If there are more stone counters on ~ than the CMC of a card exiled under it, sacrifice ~ and return that card to the battlefield.
One more idea:
Lord of the River Kingdom 3UG
Creature-Frog Warrior (rare)
Immortal (When ~ dies, put it under the top three cards of your library, face-up.)
As long as ~ is face-up on top of your library, creatures you control get +1/+1 for each land you control.
Entomb is an interesting idea but puts a real empathesis on both playing and being able to sacrifice or destroy noncreature permanents which might be a bit too demanding. If I'm forced to entomb under a land early on because I have no other noncreature permanents then should I then destroy it later on to get a creature back. Sacrificing a land on the battlfield is a steep price so the reward needs to getting the creature straight back into play.
DeleteOn the other side cards like Elixir of Immortality and spellbombs are going to be major must haves for your deck. Creature dies, I emtomb under aether spellbomb and then for the price of U, I get back my creature and either a free card or a temporary flying effect.
The question comes down to where do you see the balance ocurring? Could we get an example creature or two?
As for immortal I think there was a discussion a while ago on face cards in the library and I don;t think we found a solution the rules could support.
Entomb definitely requires more ways to sacrifice things (everyone always plays non-creature permanents)—But sacrifice is a theme we can play up for the religious aspect of Ankh-Theb anyhow. Chocolate and peanut butter.
DeleteHm. Maybe combine the "return from the grave" flavour with the "pyramids are hard work" flavour, and have creatures which can return from the graveyard if you complete some quest?
DeleteThat flavour is something like "when the workers have build a big enough pyramid around him, maybe the pharoah will come around for another go-around as ruler", so the dynasty might actually be Theb I, Theb II, Theb III, Theb I again, Theb IV, Theb III again, Theb I again, etc, etc
It's slightly different to actual Egypt, but has the right feel.
The quest could either be a propety of creatures representing mummies or non-creatures representing tombs. Either way, giving you a hoop to recurring the creature (a) lets people enjoy their big creature multiple times, which is what they want but (b) avoids repetitiveness by letting their opponent affect whether it comes back.
Reconstitute (Exile a number of creature cards from your graveyard with total mana cost equal to or greater than CARDNAME's mana cost, return it to the battlefield tapped.)
DeleteI can't see enough Immortal cards that it's worth keywording, but a cycle at rare could be a set-seller. Do the issues with face-up cards go away if we introduce a new game rule: "Turn all face-up cards in your library face-down before you shuffle your library."
DeleteLord of the River Kingdom 3UG
Creature-Frog Warrior (rare)
When ~ dies, put it under the top three cards of your library, face-up. As long as ~ is face-up on top of your library, creatures you control get +1/+1 for each land you control. (Turn all cards in your library face-down before shuffling it.)
3/4
An interesting idea, but I think the effect needs to locked down (which could be what you intended) so there aren't lots of triggers to keep on top of.
ReplyDeleteMummies tend to wish to lay undisturbed in crypts so I always read VP flavour as let me rest in peace or I will awaken and kill you, which is what I think we should try and capture. Dealing damage first though isn't popular and feels very white as an ability. Let's throw a few ideas down:
Mummify {3} (When this dies, exile it unless you pay {2}. When another card enters your graveyard happens, you may return it from the graveyard to battlefield.)"
The flavor is less clear here, why should dying trigger mummify effects, or worse discard or mill effects. Possibly dying is just easier.
Mummify {3} (When this dies, exile it unless you pay {2}. When a creature dies, you may return it from the graveyard to battlefield.)"
If undying magic managed to fit 4/5th the color wheel and morbid and unearth 3/5th, then we quickly only have ask ourselves whether white could have mummies.
Returning the dead to life is in their arsenal, even if it is not a particular common ability. Distancing the keyword from mummies might help.
Resurrection (When this dies, exile it unless you exile another creature card from your graveyard. When a creature you control dies, return ~ from the graveyard to battlefield.)
Not sure how this version plays but it feels susceptible to broken combos. We will still have some problems at common but we can at least throw down a few thought.
Burning Oil
Creature - Elemental
Haste, Trample
During your end step sacrifice ~.
Resurrection (When this dies, exile it unless you exile another creature card from your graveyard. When a creature you control dies, return ~ from the graveyard to battlefield.)
6/1
"It would be a mistake to think it truly out."
Guards of Pharoah 2WW
Vigilance
Resurrection (When this dies, exile it unless you exile another creature card from your graveyard. When a creature you control dies, return ~ from the graveyard to battlefield.)
2/3
"Our duty to pharoah will outlive our mortal forms"
Niledweller 2GG
Creature - Crocodile
When you control no other creatures, sacrifice ~.
Resurrection.
5/5
Seer of the Sands 2UU
Creature - Snake Cleric
When ~ enters the battlefield, Scry 2.
Resurrection.
2/2
"I survived without food in desert for years, what made you think your puny spear would work." - Sssshizzinik, Seer of Shenai.
Disturb (If ~ would go your graveyard from your library, put it OTB instead.)
DeleteTomb Raider 2B
Creature-Rogue cmn
Whenever ~ deals damage to a player, he or she mills that many cards. You may cast an artifact card among them without paying its mana cost.
2/2
Archaelogist 3W
Creature-Wizard cmn
When ~ ETB, you grind. Gain that much life.
1/4
or just DIG
Narcomoeba for everyone?
DeleteI could imagine a version of the game where Disturb would be a viable mechanic. Unfortunately, Narcomoeba is a 1/1 flier for 2 with Disturb and it's arguably one of the most broken cards in the game.
Maybe:
Disturb (When you are dealt combat damage, you may return one card with disturb from your graveyard to your hand if ~ is in your graveyard.)
This still doesn't care how it got to your yard, so it plays well with Dig etc. But it's also not quite as repetitive as Resurrection, where it's just impossible to kill.
Yeah, my Disturb is clearly not going to make the cut.
DeleteIs it too soon to riff on Miracles? If not, what about trying to hit the flavor of unearthing something horrifying?
ReplyDeleteMummy Lord (rare)
2BB
Creature - Zombie
Zombies you control have deathtouch.
Embalmed (When you draw this card, if it's the first card you drew this turn, you may reveal it. If you do, put a 2/2 black Zombie creature token onto the battlefield.)
2/2
Here's a keyword idea:
ReplyDeleteBurial Rite N (When this creature dies, exile it. At the beginning of your upkeep, add a time counter. When the Nth is added, cast it without paying its mana cost, and it enters the battlefield with N +1/+ counters.)
The rules require different counters because the card moves from exile to the stack and then onto the battlefield, but mechanically, you'd just move the creature into the play zone with all those time counters and poof! they are +1/+1 counters.
I think it's doable at all rarities, though the commons would need to be vanilla. What do you think?
Interesting we get a slightly slower undying for burial rights 1 and an improved effect vrs tempo for N>1. I wonder whether this effect is going to be hard to track with multiple N's as it's not counting down (i.e I have an exiled Burial Rite 3, BR 4 and BR 6 creatures all on 2 counters and during my upkeep I increase them all automatically and forget to put BR3 into play).
DeleteOne card idea:
Dead Pharoah B
Creature - Zombie
Burial Rite 5
5/0
And another
Aeon Pharoah 2UU
Creature - Avatar
Whenever a time counter is placed on ~, draw a card.
Buriel Rite 4
2/2
and another
Phage Pharoah 3BBB
Creature - Demon
Trample, Deathtouch, Lifelink, Flying
When ~ enters the battlefield, if you didn't cast it from your hand you lose the game.
Burial Rite 6
6/6
and one more
Unkillable Pharoah 3GGG
Creature - Ooze Zombie Mutant Advisor
As long as there is one or more +1/+1 counters on ~, it has Burial Rite X, where X is the number of +1/+1 counters on ~.
3/3
Epochrasite wants it's mechanic back ;)
DeleteI really don't think that Suspend is a mechanic the game is likely to return to. It has an awful lot of bookkeeping, and it hard for many new players to grok. Also, adding counters makes it more difficult to see when exactly the creature is coming back. With Suspend, if I see a creature with two counters on it, I know it's coming back in two turns. With Burial Rite, I need to constantly be checking my opponents cards. It's also hard because these creatures come into play with counters on them. With suspend, I could typically tell if a card was suspended because it had counters on it. Here, not so much.
I like the idea of a creature coming back after a time, like Vampire: the Masquerade.
DeleteI was thinking of "Suspend for Reanimator" when I came up with this, but I did not mean to re-invent Epochrasite. I just knew that if you make players wait to get the guy back, you need to reward them some other way. That's why I thought of growing the chounters and letting them double as +1/+1 counters. As for the bookeeping, that could be handled by using the same number on all of the cards with Burial Rites in the set. At least they don't get haste, that would make losing track of what's coming back extra annoying. To avoid exile altogether, you could keep them on board but tapped.
DeleteInter in the tomb N (When this creature dies, return it to the battlefield tapped. It has "This creature doesn't untap during your untap step unless it has at least N counters on it." and "At the beginning of your upkeep, if it's tapped, put a +1/+1 counter on this creature.")
Bloodthrone Vampire likes that card. a lot.
DeleteNow this just feels like a persist guy you can never kill, which is problematic for a few reasons.
Couple of ideas:
ReplyDeleteTombguard M (Whenever a creature attacks you, you may pay M. If you do, you may cast ~ from your graveyard without paying its mana cost. At end of turn, sacrifice it.)
It rises fron the grave to protect you, but only lasts for blocking
Eternal M (Return this card from your graveyard to the battlefield)
Keywording Reassembling Skeleton
As for the mummy's curse, what about -
Vengeance - Whenever ~ enters the battlefield from the graveyard, do X
Tomb guard is interesting, kind of an Unearth on defense. The problem I see is that it's a lot harder for the opponent to track. You'd constantly be asking for the opponents yard to make sure they didn't have one. It's also problematic that it leads to stalls, instead of advancing the game like unearth.
ReplyDeleteReassembling skeleton is an awesome card, but it's also already strong as a 1/1 for 2. Allowing larger creatures to keep coming back is super repetitive and frustrating.
Vengeance- Maybe, but without a way to return these cards, it really limits the ability to black. Like Innistrad, you'd really want to see mummies outside of just one color.
I know this mechanic has been floated a lot, but:
Vengeance- X, exile this card from your graveyard: do whatever. Activate this ability as a sorcery.
Could be interesting. Works well with Dig, not to complex.
Speaking of Unearth, we could use that instead of reinventing the wheel.
DeleteThe same could be said for persist and undying. Right now it seems inevitable that a return to graveyard mechanic will represent mummies (although there other good ideas out there that don't do that). Unearth viability will be whether or not a mummy return to make a one off attack feels in theme. I'd say no, mummies don't return when they feel like, they return when disturbed, so how about a modified Unearth:
DeleteUntomb [Cost] - When one or more creatures are attacking you or a planeswalker you control you may pay [cost and return ~ to the battlefield. It blocks this turn if able. Exile it during your end step.
Here's another idea that plays to life and death by literally requiring a life payment. I was brainstorming reasons for players to play Mummies in BR WB or GW decks. We want them to have a few colors. Anyways:
ReplyDeleteRewrap N (When this creature dies, exile it. At the beginning of your end step, if you have more life than each opponent, you may pay N life to cast this card from exile without paying its mana cost.)
The endstep trigger prevents Bloodthrone Vampire abuse. And the life lead clause gives you a reason to splash burn or lifegain colors. Thoughts? Tweaks?
I see that the more life clause is there to stop it from coming back at some point, but a heftier life payment would probably do a better job of preventing repetitive gameplay in most cases and is easier to track. That said, there are a whole lot of players who despise paying life, so even if this version has good gameplay it may not be a road we want to go down.
DeleteVertical cycle of zombies in black that keep recurring as long as the target of their ire remains on the battlefield:
ReplyDeleteMummified Retainer - 1B
Creature - Zombie (Common)
2/1
When ~ ETB, put a curse counter on target creature an opponent controls.
When ~ dies, if an opponent controls a creature with a curse counter, return ~ to the battlefield tapped.
The Royal Formerly - 2BB
Creature - Zombie (Uncommon)
4/3
Intimidate
When ~ ETB, put a curse counter on target creature an opponent controls.
When ~ dies, if an opponent controls a creature with a curse counter, return ~ to the battlefield tapped.
King Tut
Legendary Creature - Zombie (Mythic)
5/5
Deathtouch
B, T: Put a curse counter on target creature an opponent controls.
When ~ ETB, put a curse counter on target creature an opponent controls.
When ~ dies, if an opponent controls a creature with a curse counter, return ~ to the battlefield tapped.
I like the idea that your creatures vanish upon death if you don't embalm them. Instead of trying to reanimate them, they can provide other benefits in the graveyard:
ReplyDeleteVersion 1:
Cat Priest 1W
Creature - Cat Cleric (C)
Mummify - When ~ dies (or, "is put into your graveyard from anywhere"), exile it unless you pay 2.
At the beginning of your upkeep, if ~ is in your graveyard, gain 1 life.
2/2
Version 2:
Pharaoh 2BB
Creature - Human Archon (R)
Mummify - When ~ dies, exile it unless you pay 2.
BB, exile ~ from your graveyard: put a 6/6 zombie creature token onto the battlefield.
2/2