Weekend Art ChallengeGreetings, artisans! Click through to see this weekend's art and the design requirements for your single card submission, due Monday morning. Every submission warrants feedback, and everyone is encouraged to give feedback. You may use that feedback to revise your submission any number of times, though only the version rendered will be included in the review, if that happens.
This weekend, the world we're designing for is one from your fellow artisan, Alex Churchill. We're excited at the prospect of seeing more of our community's own work, and leveraging our combined skill to help artisan's improve their work. Alex is building the set on Multiverse and you can find the overall description of it, his goals and parameters HERE. It's meant to emulate the anime series, Code Geass. If you'd like to help him with his set, you can make suggestions and leave comments on that site, and he'll be able to sift through them, consider them, and/or respond as he sees fit.
Here, we're going to focus purely on the challenge at hand. That challenge? Design a keyword or ability word for the Black Knight faction and submit a common card using this art and that mechanic. Alex has specified that the Black Knights are red in his set. They are a group of rebels in conflict with the BW Brittanian faction and are fighting for freedom.
First off, the Geass mechanic as proposed by the design doc sounds like it wants a way to track it, if that can be achieved without using too many words. Maybe counters, imprint/exile; I'm not sure.
ReplyDeleteIs this where we want some sort of creature count or power matters mechanic? Something that works when you're behind suits the feel of rebels.
Rebellious Warrior 2R
Creature - Human Rebel (C)
For the Cause — When Rebellious Warrior enters the battlefield, if it is the only creature you control, it deals 3 damage to target player.
3/2
Wordless Blademaster 3R
Creature - Human Rebel (C)
Overthrow - When Wordless Blademaster enters the battlefield, if an opponent controls a creature with power greater than it, it gets +3/+0 and gains haste until end of turn.
3/2
Other directions based on "opponent has something in greater amounts than me", with varying degrees of suitability as a red mechanic:
Angry Reclaimer 4R
Creature - Human Rebel (C)
Take from the rich - When Angry Reclaimer enters the battlefield, if an opponent controls more lands than you, destroy target land.
3/3
Pain Savant 1R
Creature - Human Rebel (C)
"Dethrone without multiplayer matters" i.e works when your opponent has more life than you (not particularly suited to red)
2/1
Rebels also like to attack:
Blade of the People 4R
Creature - Human Rebel (C)
First strike
Overthrow (This costs 1 less to cast for each creature you attacked with this turn.)
3/1
Sword of the Black Knights R
Creature - Human Rebel (C)
Haste
Raid - Sword of the Black Knights enters the battlefield with a +1/+1 counter on it if you attacked with a creature with turn. (as seen in Khans of Tarkir)
1/1
Rebel tribal isn't really a mechanic, but we could see it here.
Inspired Bladecaptain 2R
Creature - Human Rebel (C)
Trample
Whenever another Rebel creature you control attacks, Inspired Bladecaptain gets +1/+0 until end of turn.
2/2
Hidden information and guerilla warfare is also a Rebel-style thing.
Black Knight Informant 3R
Creature - Human Rebel (C)
Sabotage - Whenever a creature enters the battlefield under your opponent's control, you may pay 1R and reveal Black Knight Informant from your hand. If you did, cast it without paying its mana cost. (and various versions that Sabotage different things, ala traps from Zendikar)
3/2
Thanks, Aura. Since this is also a WAC, please choose one design to be your submission for the challenge.
DeleteYeah, I figured since this was more of a set design type thing I'd just throw down a lot of thoughts. Let's go with:
DeleteBlade of the People 3R
Creature - Human Rebel (C)
First strike
Overthrow (This costs 1 less to cast for each creature you attacked with this turn.)
3/1
Since I still quite like that mechanic, and it fits well enough here.
Awesome thoughts, Aura! Thanks a lot for the big brainstorm :D
DeleteYou're right that the Geass mechanic I've got on Multiverse does need a way to track it. Exiling the instant/sorcery under the creature it affects is a very sensible approach, and I can probably rig something similar for Auras.
I really like your first Overthrow; it's like reverse Dominance, playing into the feeling of being the underdog. Not sure how it'd play in Limited, but I could give it some further investigation.
A variation of Raid is definitely a possibility. Having started work on this set shortly before Khans preview cards came out, the similarity between Raid+Prowess+Morph and things I was considering for the Code Geass set was somewhat disconcerting. If Raid, or a tweak on it like your final Overthrow, is the right thing to use then I should probably just use it.
The Sabotage idea of getting creatures for a discount if your opponent does various things is intriguing. Hidden information is an area that plays well with the flavour I'm going for, so yes, I could see using that idea.
I've two ideas for mechanics I quite like, but neither quite fits. Feel free to adapt them if anyone thinks they can, I will come back with an actual entry for the challenge if I can.
ReplyDelete1. First mechanic:
Overthrow (If an opponent controls more creatures than you, CARDNAME can't be blocked except by two or more creatures. Otherwise, when it attacks or blocks, it gets +1/+1 UEOT.)
Having both states is probably too complex for common, I'm trying to think of a better variant. The reason for them is, this captures the feel of the black knight rebellion -- focussing on infiltration against a superior enemy to start with, but becoming a powerful military force when the momentum swings their way.
The tricky bit is getting the triggers for the two states to line up. The stat boost wants to be locked in on attack (or block, or maybe only on attack?) so it doesn't lose toughness later in the turn which is always confusing. But it feels like the infiltration bonus should depend on the number of creatures at time of blocking. Anyone see a way of streamlining this?
2. Second mechanic:
Abet 1 ({T}: If target creature attacks this turn, it gets +1/+0 and gains trample UEOT)
Like a red exalted. The connection to black knights is in the flavour of the name, and the idea of rushing into battle, but only with carefully chosen forces, reserves abetting from the sidelines.
On uncommons and rares, you can also have extra effects "Abet N. // If ~ abets a creature, it gets [extra effect]"
3. Submission.
However, the art shows Zero (I think?), but the card can't be Zero since he's not common and probably B or BW not R. So I ideally want to think of a mechanic like Cipher which can be combat-y but go on an instant or sorcery. I will come back with one if I can. If I can't, I'll pretend the art shows a lesser leader sending troops into battle, which would fit with "Abet" and construct a submission card.
Submission.
DeleteRaid leader. 1R.
Creature - Human Rebel (common)
2/1.
Abet 1 ({T}: If target creature attacks this turn, it gets +1/+0 and gains trample UEOT.)
I decided to forgo a closer connection to the art to showcase the common-est form of the mechanic. The art might fit better on an uncommon with something like "when abetted creature deals combat damage to a player, untap this", maybe with abet 2.
You're right, the art is of Lelouch, the commander of the Black Knights, so not quite what you'd expect on a common. I'll try to coordinate better with Jay for the next challenge :)
DeleteThe Abet mechanic ends up weirdly similar to banding. Which is no bad thing: banding had good gameplay, it was just far too confusing, so separating out parts of it into individual mechanics is a good thing. I'd want to sync up the Abet number with the creature's power, both for flavour and in order to make it feel not too bad to be using your creature for abet rather than directly in combat.
I'm not hugely keen on sorcery-speed tap abilities (like Outlast in Khans of Tarkir), so I might want to tweak that somehow. I wonder if your proposed rider "when abetted creature deals combat damage to a player, untap this" could be factored into the main mechanic definition?
Freedom FIghter 1R
ReplyDeleteCreature - Human Rebel
Revolution (7: Transform all rebels you control.)
2/1
-----
Respected Soldier
Creature -- Human Soldier
When this creature transforms into ~, creatures can't block this turn.
2/3
Whoops, I forgot to say: Common
DeleteI'm going to change this slightly to:
DeleteFreedom FIghter 1R
Creature - Human Rebel (C)
Revolution (7: Transform all rebels you control.)
2/1
-----
Respected Soldier
Creature -- Human Soldier (C)
When this creature transforms into ~, target creature can't block this turn.
2/3
The idea here is for all Rebels to be doublefaced and have the Revolution ability on the front (though arguably not all of them would need it?) Activating Revolution is expensive (7 mana) but flips all your rebels, and hopefully gives you One Big Turn. 7 Mana is expensive enough that even getting there is a tenuous proposition and requires careful planning by both players.
DeleteIt is, of course, essential that rebels not be rebels on the back side so they don't flip back if you have multiple revolutions.
If they're going to be Rebels it would be nice if they had some backwards compatibility with the other Rebels in Magic. That said, the mechanic idea is very cool and stands up well on its own.
DeleteThe nice thing about past rebels is that just putting the creature type "Rebel" on them makes them backwards compatible to some extent. If that was a serious issue one could make it "Revolutionary" but I'd rather casual players have the option to dig this guy up with Ramosian Sergeant.
DeleteGood point.
DeleteWow, I hadn't actually expected to try to capture multiple stages of the Black Knights' progression on the same card. It's a pretty compelling idea though. It'd certainly give One Big Turn, if you can hold out as far as 7 mana. (It gives curious flavour if you cast fresh Rebels after activating Revolution on some previous ones.)
DeleteI'm not sure the idea of "stall until 7 mana, then charge" is quite compatible with how I was picturing the rest of the set playing out.
Adding DFCs is quite a big step, for logistical reasons, but I'm sure we could find other mechanics to make use of DFCs if I do let them get into the set. The anime has several characters with secret identities, or who emerge from some kind of transformation, and DFCs are great for reflecting that kind of thing.
I think you're not going to get two states in the same set; the same mechanic probably can't handle both "outmatched freedom fighters" and "rebel army". And rebel army is more generic and can be done without a mechanic, probably, so I'm going with the first half.
ReplyDeleteOverthrow -- When ~ attacks, if you control fewer creatures than defending player, .
Overthrow -- When ~ becomes blocked by a creature, if you control fewer creatures than defending player, .
I think these are similar enough that they could coexist and feel like a unified mechanic, but if that's not true in playtesting it could go either way.
Specific submission:
Partisan Saboteur 3R
Creature - Human Rogue
Overthrow -- When Partisan Saboteur becomes blocked by a creature, if you control fewer creatures than defending player, deal 2 damage to that creature.
3/2
The "fewer creatures" thing is plenty interesting without tying it to attacking / blocking or any particular type of trigger. The situations in which you're OK with attacking into a greater number of creatures are also worryingly few. I'd be inclined to just say "Overthrow-- If you control fewer creatures than an opponent, [ability]" and use it give creatures stat bonuses, ETB triggers, and that sort of thing.
DeleteThat's true, but "fewer creatures" by itself isn't a red ability. Red is second only to white in how much it likes flooding the board with cheap creatures.
DeleteAlso, having it be a significant restriction justifies fairly powerful effects even on low-rarity cards for draft. Which makes them read well.
Very interesting idea. I agree with both of you: if the opponent's got more creatures then normally you won't want to be attacking, but that lets you put rather powerful effects on the trigger for when you do. The problem is that the opponent would often be happy to just declare no blockers and swing back for devastating. It might be possible to carefully craft some creature designs which would abet this situation somehow.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteHow about an ability that triggers on getting enough combat damage in one turn? It plays up the "rebel" feel in encouraging you to make risky attacks and giving you momentum once you connect. It also has a linear element (since if one trigger happens, all of them do). It could look something like:
DeleteRebel Recruiter 2R
Creature- Human Rebel (Common)
3/1
Overthrow-- Whenever an opponent is dealt 4 or more damage in the same combat damage step, put a 1/1 red Human Rebel creature token onto the battlefield.
And of course the obligatory rare:
DeleteRebel Strategist 3RR
Creature- Human Rebel (Rare)
4/3
Overthrow-- Whenever an opponent is dealt 4 or more damage in the same combat damage step, if it's the first combat phase this turn, untap all creatures you control. After this phase, there is an additional combat phase.
Ooh, I like this idea. You'd need to make sure the lure is big enough but balanced, and maybe the timing tweaked, I'm not sure. But I like that it encourages dangerous attacks into superior forces, with a big payoff if they succeed, that's very like a rebellion.
DeleteI'd prefer "in one turn" to be easier to parse.
DeleteThe timing is weird, I agree. The first question to answer is whether we want the overthrow ability to trigger if the creature dies. If not then it's safe to say something like "At the end of each turn, if an opponent lost 4 or more life this turn, EFFECT"-- though that makes Rebel Strategist unfortunately not work. Otherwise, I think it's best to trigger on the combat damage itself, since it's weird to say something like "whenever an opponent takes his/or her fourth point of damage this turn".
DeleteI think saying "you have to be alive to overthrow someone" is fine so one could just say "Overthrow -- At the end of your turn, if an opponent has lost 4 or more life this turn, [effect]" like Sygg. I do understand this is a pretty different mechanic from the one you originally suggested, but it is a lot cleaner!
DeleteAgreed. New wording:
DeleteRebel Recruiter 2R
Creature- Human Rebel (Common)
3/1
Overthrow-- At the end of your turn, if an opponent lost 4 or more life this turn, put a 1/1 red Human Rebel creature token onto the battlefield.
Distortion Strike reprint here I come!
DeleteExcellent!
DeletePity the Strategist can't work under this new wording. Perhaps it could be "At end of combat on your turn"?
Anyway, this has excellent flavour and looks like it should have good gameplay in a pleasingly small number of words. It's somewhat "win-more", but that effect ought to be mitigated by the rest of the set with its focus on combat tricks, similar to how the Gatecrash designers put in lots of ways to allow you to reach a state where you can make a Battalion attack this turn but not every turn, like Act of Treason, Mugging, and so on.
I just want to throw out there that this would be another setting that would really benefit from having Watermark matters cards.
ReplyDeleteThis is another setting where I would disagree. You have colors, abilities, and creature types available to distinguish the factions-- why add in something so transparently artificial and incompatible with everything else in Magic?
DeleteIf you want to do faction-matters, my first instinct would be to bring back the Rebels vs. Mercenaries conflict, which provides cool tribal effects and seems pretty close to this world's story.
I'm not sure what you're planning on doing with green and blue in this setting. I think green could ally with red pretty easily (protecting their homeland), so here's a green-red mechanic:
ReplyDeleteInspired Protectors 3G
Led by example - If you control a creature with greater power than CARDNAME, CARDNAME gains "When this creature attacks, regenerate target creature."
2/4
This might just be worse than a Led By Example (in secret Ferocious) threshold mechanic.
DeleteThanks! I didn't go into it on the main intro page because I was trying to keep it short. Green is actually rather hard to find human factions that identify with it; my plan is to treat green as meaning "traditionalist", so the traditionalist Japanese end up green, as do Tohdoh and his Four Holy Swords. (This actually suggests bushido as a green mechanic, which flavour-wise is a little weird but mechanics-wise works wonderfully - it's like a Rootwalla that triggers in the combat step, how green can you get?)
DeleteBlue is also tricky. The Black Knights and Britannians both have a number of scientists and researchers designing their Knightmares, so I'm thinking the black-white Britannians and the red Black Knights with their green allies will both touch blue for their R&D base: Lloyd, Cécile, Rakshata, and their technicians. The other idea is that many of the cunning majors, captains, and other wily military tacticians could be blue... it's a bit of a stretch, but if I find an instants-themed mechanic that would help it a lot.
I'll try this mechanic out again, with a new name:
ReplyDeleteOverthrow--Whenever CARDNAME attacks with a creature that shares a creature type with it,...
So for this specifically:
The People's Sword 2RR
Creature - Human Rebel (C)
Overthrow--Whenever The People's Sword attacks with a creature that shares a creature type with it, it gets +2/+2 until end of turn.
3/3
The name is bad, but whatever. Feedback appreciated as always.
Nifty. Basically ends up working like battalion-for-2, especially in this set where almost all the creature cards unfortunately have to be Human. Perhaps we can make it "attacks with another Rebel". The design space is pretty similar to battalion, and the cards may end up looking fairly similar too, especially at common and uncommon. That might not be especially much of a problem.
DeleteThanks all for your suggestions! In a very frustrating quirk of timing, my home internet connection was down all weekend, so I wasn't able to be contributing feedback during the weekend :(
ReplyDeleteI'm really excited by the prospect of getting to contribute to other Artisans' designs, and very grateful to have a good crop of suggestions for mechanics for the Black Knights here. I'll be trying to give several of these a playtest!
I'm rendering the 5 submissions for review.
ReplyDelete